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(Licensing for Waihekepedia - Discussion)
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Can you help clarify this for everyone please ?
 
Can you help clarify this for everyone please ?
  
== Licensing for Waihekepedia - Discussion ==
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Well... ok, here we go (again)I guess... :-) but it's important stuff if we're really a "community" because the community may actually be much larger than us in the short and hopefully the long term and getting the licensing right at the start helps sustain the type of information we're gathering, aggregating, creating here and can make that information freely available for as wide a use as possible. There are two licenses used for textual works that embody what is called '[http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/ copyleft]', the GFDL which the wiki is currently using but perhaps just by default as the MediaWiki software that runs this wiki is essentially a product of Wikipedia (which uses the GFDL), and the '''Creative Commons Attribution Share-Alike''' license, commonly referred to as CC-By-SA. Wikipedia uses the GFDL but primarily because when Wikipedia started there was no other option; the Creative Commons wasn't around yet. The GFDL is not a very good license for content of the nature of a Wikipedia, but it was all they had at the time so now they're pretty much stuck with it. A better license is perhaps the CC-By-SA, which you can see here: http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/
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== Time for a captcha? ==
  
For a more detailed look at perhaps why these licensing issues are important it might be worth taking a look at the [http://freedomdefined.org/Definition Free Cultural Works Definition] and seeing whether the values of Waihekepedia align. Also take a look at the Wikitravel site's explanation of their licensing: http://wikitravel.org/en/Wikitravel:How_to_re-distribute_Wikitravel_content
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spam seems to be increasing quite steadily -- which could be read as a somewhat good sign I suppose -- someone's paying attention. Is it time to install a captcha? bruce? anyone against it? it can make getting an account a bit more difficult. [[User:Countrymike|Countrymike]] 20:29, 9 October 2007 (NZDT)
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:I don't have a problem with a captcha, although there should be a mechanism for blind users to email someone to request an account. However, the spam is low volume so far, so I'm not sure if its a bot or a person.
  
One of the difficulties with the GFDL is that is requires that texts that are printed out be printed out with a copy of the license -- which is about 10 pages of semi-legalese ramblings, which doesn't make much sense for small articles that you may want in an information center in Artworks. The CC-By-SA is really designed more for this type of content, whereas the GFDL is originally for larger software documentation.  
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:Given the response times to spam so far, we'd be in real trouble if a bot started pumping out several pages a second. The solution to this would be to have a lawbot watching for excessive edit rates and blocking any such account until an admin can investigate. As far as I know, there is no such feature built in to MediaWiki, but there are such bots running on Wikipedia and we could probably borrow one. However, database structures have changed over the years, and I don't know if a current bot will run correctly on such an old version of MediaWiki.
  
As you might have guessed I've got a bit of experience in this Wiki thing -- it's pretty much one of my great passions in life and you've just managed to beat me to the punch on creating one for Waiheke, so if you'd prefer to have a chat about all this in the [[Lazy Lounge]] say, then i'd be keen on that as well and I may know a few others ... not that I know who you are because you haven't filled in your user page and you don't sign your posts ;-) [[User:Countrymike|Countrymike]] 15:01, 31 August 2007 (NZST)
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::I'd also kind of prefer to avoid if it's still maintanable. I've seen on wikieducator just how much of a barrier they can be to newbies, so i'd still prefer to not to have to implement if we can avoid it. [[User:Countrymike|Countrymike]] 22:07, 9 October 2007 (NZDT)
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:Is there any procedure set up to become an admin here? I'd like to be more effective than just blanking spam pages.-[[User:Gadfium|Gadfium]] 21:37, 9 October 2007 (NZDT)
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:Gadfium: I've made you sysop. I've known Gadfiums work and contributions to Wikipedia for a long time and can vouch for his being added to the Sysop group. [[User:Countrymike|Countrymike]] 22:07, 9 October 2007 (NZDT)
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::I'm happy to wait for a discussion to take place. I've added a note to my user page on Wikipedia in case there's any doubt that I'm the same editor.-[[User:Gadfium|Gadfium]] 22:13, 9 October 2007 (NZDT)
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Hey all - I agree with the captcha as the spam is getting annoying - however I have tried the two extensions available and cant get either of them working - mostly because we are running an older version of Mediawik - it may have to either wait until we upgrade or  may requrie someone with more technical expertise with Wikis than me. What I have done in the interim as add a javascript confirm to the registration screen to hopefully stop bots registering - if anyone is getting through that it most likely will be a person = welcome to Gadfium as admin[[User:Bruced|Bruced]]
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:Unfortunately my admin status was removed after three minutes. I presume that there will be a discussion about me amongst the founders of this site and I'll hear eventually about whether I'm considered suitable. If I can provide any information to help the process, please let me know.-[[User:Gadfium|Gadfium]] 13:41, 10 October 2007 (NZDT)
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: Yea, mines been removed too... apparently for making [[User:Gadfium|Gadfium]] a sysop but the mysterious User:Operator user has left no real reason why i was desysopped. I'd like to be reinstated if possible. I've had enough recently of community projects being dictated to as if they weren't. [[User:Countrymike|Countrymike]] 13:54, 10 October 2007 (NZDT)
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I see Gadfium and CountryMike are back as sysops which is how things should be - saves me having to reinstate them myself - it's a community project people (to anyone listening) - if you've been paying attention to the internet's development you will have noticed that any attempt to censor or dictate usually just results in re-routing to avoid the obstacle. Lets all play nice :-) [[User:Bruced|Bruced]] 15:43, 11 October 2007 (NZDT)
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== Self Reliance Initiatives ==
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seems to me that these should start becoming their own pages with a category (I think one already exists) instead of just congregating here. [[User:Countrymike|Countrymike]] 10:53, 1 February 2010 (NZDT)
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:I agree.-[[User:Gadfium|gadfium]] 17:39, 1 February 2010 (NZDT)

Latest revision as of 19:54, 30 June 2018

I'd love to contribute to Waihekepedia, but firstly i'd like a more concrete statement about what license my content would be covered by/under. This page: Waihekepedia:General disclaimer suggests that you're using the GFDL, but it also seems pretty much the stock page that comes with a MediaWiki install. Will content in Waihekepedia be licensed under the GFDL or could the community also consider using the the CC-By-SA license instead that is used by many similar projects, notably WikiTravel? Personally I think that the CC-BY-SA is more in line with this kind of project and it would be good to think/discuss this in a bit more detail first before too much content is entered. Countrymike 11:08, 31 August 2007 (NZST)

Well Country Mike - we'll obviously have to educate ourselves about the differences between the two licenses.

GFDL

CC by SA ? all I can find out is that it must be some variation of the Creative Commons license

Creative Commons

Can you help clarify this for everyone please ?

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Time for a captcha?

spam seems to be increasing quite steadily -- which could be read as a somewhat good sign I suppose -- someone's paying attention. Is it time to install a captcha? bruce? anyone against it? it can make getting an account a bit more difficult. Countrymike 20:29, 9 October 2007 (NZDT)

I don't have a problem with a captcha, although there should be a mechanism for blind users to email someone to request an account. However, the spam is low volume so far, so I'm not sure if its a bot or a person.
Given the response times to spam so far, we'd be in real trouble if a bot started pumping out several pages a second. The solution to this would be to have a lawbot watching for excessive edit rates and blocking any such account until an admin can investigate. As far as I know, there is no such feature built in to MediaWiki, but there are such bots running on Wikipedia and we could probably borrow one. However, database structures have changed over the years, and I don't know if a current bot will run correctly on such an old version of MediaWiki.
I'd also kind of prefer to avoid if it's still maintanable. I've seen on wikieducator just how much of a barrier they can be to newbies, so i'd still prefer to not to have to implement if we can avoid it. Countrymike 22:07, 9 October 2007 (NZDT)
Is there any procedure set up to become an admin here? I'd like to be more effective than just blanking spam pages.-Gadfium 21:37, 9 October 2007 (NZDT)
Gadfium: I've made you sysop. I've known Gadfiums work and contributions to Wikipedia for a long time and can vouch for his being added to the Sysop group. Countrymike 22:07, 9 October 2007 (NZDT)
I'm happy to wait for a discussion to take place. I've added a note to my user page on Wikipedia in case there's any doubt that I'm the same editor.-Gadfium 22:13, 9 October 2007 (NZDT)

Hey all - I agree with the captcha as the spam is getting annoying - however I have tried the two extensions available and cant get either of them working - mostly because we are running an older version of Mediawik - it may have to either wait until we upgrade or may requrie someone with more technical expertise with Wikis than me. What I have done in the interim as add a javascript confirm to the registration screen to hopefully stop bots registering - if anyone is getting through that it most likely will be a person = welcome to Gadfium as adminBruced

Unfortunately my admin status was removed after three minutes. I presume that there will be a discussion about me amongst the founders of this site and I'll hear eventually about whether I'm considered suitable. If I can provide any information to help the process, please let me know.-Gadfium 13:41, 10 October 2007 (NZDT)
Yea, mines been removed too... apparently for making Gadfium a sysop but the mysterious User:Operator user has left no real reason why i was desysopped. I'd like to be reinstated if possible. I've had enough recently of community projects being dictated to as if they weren't. Countrymike 13:54, 10 October 2007 (NZDT)

I see Gadfium and CountryMike are back as sysops which is how things should be - saves me having to reinstate them myself - it's a community project people (to anyone listening) - if you've been paying attention to the internet's development you will have noticed that any attempt to censor or dictate usually just results in re-routing to avoid the obstacle. Lets all play nice :-) Bruced 15:43, 11 October 2007 (NZDT)

Self Reliance Initiatives

seems to me that these should start becoming their own pages with a category (I think one already exists) instead of just congregating here. Countrymike 10:53, 1 February 2010 (NZDT)

I agree.-gadfium 17:39, 1 February 2010 (NZDT)